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(Yesterday, 11:29 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Probably yes, although Hubbard was more proven but lower ceiling coming out of college whereas Stewart is higher ceiling but less proven, so more risk-reward there.
Hubbard had 30 TFLs and 17.5 sacks in 40 games in college.
Stewart had 12 TFLs and 4.5 sacks in 37 games.
Hubbard has averaged 6.3 sacks and 9 TFLs per season across his career.
That's a solid DE in the NFL, but Hubbard was a 3rd rounder whereas Stewart 17th overall, so expectations should be higher than that for Stewart.
Stewart was a 5 star recruit coming out of high school too. Those guys generally are the cream of the crop. Yet, yeah they don't all make it to the Pros.
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This franchise is a train wreck.
RG battle is between a journeyman fringe guy and last year's backup.
Contract disputes have our best defensive player and an already highly dubious FRP holding out.
32M in unused cap space for a team in a win-now mode with holes that should have been easily addressed in FA.
People find ways to defend these crooks. It’s beyond comprehension.
If you see something suspicious, say something suspicious.
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(06-10-2025, 04:49 PM)samhain Wrote: It shows you how poorly thought out the whole thing is. If I was ready to let a guy like Trey walk should his demands get out of hand, I might get some insurance. Take away the leverage. If Josh Sweat was on the depth chart (just an example), Trey's leverage would be hugely diminished. Heck, even if they doubled up in the draft with Green or Eziueraku in 2 or 3.
When they offered Trey their $28 million a year and he said no, they should have made their best and final offer. IF that didn't get accepted, you trade him. Maybe you get a 2nd Round pick. Maybe a 3rd.
But, nope. They set a high price tag in a trade too...which didn't get met.
But, you trade Trey and get like a 2nd Round pick and you have his cap room to sign like a Trey Young, etc.
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It's next season and I'm hopeful
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(Yesterday, 11:35 AM)RunKijanaRun Wrote: This franchise is a train wreck.
RG battle is between a journeyman fringe guy and last year's backup.
Contract disputes have our best defensive player and an already highly dubious FRP holding out.
32M in unused cap space for a team in a win-now mode with holes that should have been easily addressed in FA.
People find ways to defend these crooks. It’s beyond comprehension.
Mike and Katie epitomize why any competent owner should hire legit people to run the front office and kick back to watch the money roll in. They’re in way over their heads, and have been for 34 years. The team wins despite their ineptitude.
Through 2024
Mike Brown Owner/GM record: 34 years 232-311-4 .419 winning pct.
Playoff Record: 5-9 .357 winning pct.
Zac Taylor coaching record: 6 years 46-52-1 .470 winning pct.
Playoff Record: 5-2 .714 winning pct.
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Media is already all over the Shermar left Minicamp due to contract dispute narrative. Bengals can't catch a break (even if this is self inflicted).
This has snowballed. Zac didn't even express confidence this would be resolved by Training camp.
Yet another season we aren't going to get much production out of our 1st round pick (although we did good with getting Mims on the field).
![[Image: 4CV0TeR.png]](https://i.imgur.com/4CV0TeR.png)
Quote:"Success doesn’t mean every single move they make is good" ~ Anonymous
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This is pretty embarrassing. You can choose to fight this battle, but not the same time you are fighting the battle with Trey. Had Trey not been in flux, sure go for trying to get your language where you want it but with both the optics are just awful.
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(Yesterday, 12:18 PM)Au165 Wrote: This is pretty embarrassing. You can choose to fight this battle, but not the same time you are fighting the battle with Trey. Had Trey not been in flux, sure go for trying to get your language where you want it but with both the optics are just awful.
And the worst part for fans of the team...the front office gives zero cares about optics. Never have.
"Hope is not a strategy"
"The measure of a man's intelligence can be seen in the length of his argument."
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I seen Morrison mentioned minicamp ended this morning and there were no post camp meetings.
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In 30 years maybe Katie’s kids will be better at this than Mike and herself. Until then get used to the clown show…
Through 2024
Mike Brown Owner/GM record: 34 years 232-311-4 .419 winning pct.
Playoff Record: 5-9 .357 winning pct.
Zac Taylor coaching record: 6 years 46-52-1 .470 winning pct.
Playoff Record: 5-2 .714 winning pct.
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(Yesterday, 12:27 PM)t3r3e3 Wrote: In 30 years maybe Katie’s kids will be better at this than Mike and herself. Until then get used to the clown show…
I already put my eggs in Katie's basket, hoping she would route the ship in terms of ownership style. I don't have another 30 years in me to hope for the same with her children. Lost in all of this is Troy Blackburn. Dude married into money and is heavily involved in operations. If the Bengals had their own version of Succession, Troy would be the cheaper version of Tom Wambsgans.
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(Yesterday, 12:09 PM)jj22 Wrote: Media is already all over the Shermar left Minicamp due to contract dispute narrative. Bengals can't catch a break (even if this is self inflicted).
This has snowballed. Zac didn't even express confidence this would be resolved by Training camp.
Yet another season we aren't going to get much production out of our 1st round pick (although we did good with getting Mims on the field).
Personally, i think this falls on ownership and the players representation.
I look at our 2nd round pick. Kids still unsigned but he's been out there every day of mini camp from my understanding.
Which one is gonna be ready to go? I'm kind of hoping that in this new scheme that some of our other young guys step up like they started to towards the end of the season.
That way, yes Stewart is a wasted pick, but could eventually be worth something.
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The league should step in at some point...either force to sell or at least modernize the FO.
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(Yesterday, 11:31 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: As far as reps, they're not practicing in pads, right? I don't know how much just being out there going through the motions helps.
I had heard during the draft from more than one source that he didn't appear to have a pass rush plan/moves when rushing. Just getting any chance to work with him would probably help some.
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(Yesterday, 12:06 PM)pally Wrote:
"not the best case scenario for how Spring could have gone....."
It's teetering on being a disaster of a spring.
Quote:"Success doesn’t mean every single move they make is good" ~ Anonymous
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(Yesterday, 12:59 PM)CottonHill Wrote: The league should step in at some point...either force to sell or at least modernize the FO.
That’s probably the only solution. I’m not sure how much longer I can force myself to give a damn. The team needs to be sold - forcibly if push comes to shove.
If you see something suspicious, say something suspicious.
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(Yesterday, 12:59 PM)CottonHill Wrote: The league should step in at some point...either force to sell or at least modernize the FO.
Has that ever happened in the history of the NFL?
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(Yesterday, 09:54 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Stewart had all of...12 across 37 games in college.
I'm sure I'm being unfairly harsh to some degree, but the dude just never had it click in college after 3 seasons.
He got close but no cigar often. There's just HOPE that that eventually turns into actual production in the NFL.
This reminds me of when we touted Carl Lawson because he had a lot of pressures but few sacks.
According to PFF, Lawson was 4th in the league in pressures in 2020 with 64 of them, but he only ended up having 5.5 sacks.
Turns out, Lawson has now played 7 seasons in the league (missed 2021 due to injury) and has never had more sacks than the 8.5 he had as a rookie and is now relegated to a rotational player.
I can see Stewart following a similar path where he may get close on plays often but it may not really amount to much because it really needed to be a true TFL or sack to be a game-impacting play.
As CrazyJDawg pointed out, injuries were the reason for Carl never making the jump. When he was healthy he could lower his shoulder and
get bend like no other on the edge. Too bad the injuries piled up for him. I just think almost every reason for Stewart's poor production can
be coached up and he has all intangibles to be great. Who knows though, I certainly don't like hearing him opening his mouth like he has or
leaving camp early. He might actually be a head case even though that wasn't the case prior to the Draft.
Maybe we should of taken Starks and Mike Green instead looking back. But Stewart could very well end up signing and being special.
But how can you coach up a head case?
The FO is to blame the most, but it has also made Shemar look bad IMO.
(Yesterday, 11:24 AM)CJD Wrote: A Hubbard-esque career is what I'm hoping for, yea. It's just a shame they chose to spend a 1st round pick on a position/caliber of player there. The last time we drafted a Sam Hubbard, it only cost us a 3rd round pick.
I guess they're hoping his elite athleticism will make him Sam Hubbard Plus.
Sure hope we are hoping for more than a Hubbard-esque career for Stewart. I know I am, I am expecting big things.
(Yesterday, 11:29 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Probably yes, although Hubbard was more proven but lower ceiling coming out of college whereas Stewart is higher ceiling but less proven, so more risk-reward there.
Hubbard had 30 TFLs and 17.5 sacks in 40 games in college.
Stewart had 12 TFLs and 4.5 sacks in 37 games.
Hubbard has averaged 6.3 sacks and 9 TFLs per season across his career.
That's a solid DE in the NFL, but Hubbard was a 3rd rounder whereas Stewart 17th overall, so expectations should be higher than that for Stewart.
Yeah, Hubbard was solid and just stayed solid until he got injured.
If Shemar can be coached up we should expect more flash for damn sure and better numbers from the much more explosive End.
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I was hunting for something about whether this clause is unique to the Bengals. Per Goodberry it seems it is not...
https://x.com/JoeGoodberry/status/1933189310393561401
If this actually is a common clause in rookie deals then Stewart is in the wrong. It sounds like the Bengals in the past agreed to drop it but seem now to be including it. Maybe incidents like Henry Ruggs have changed their minds, and the clause is specific - the default has to be due to suspension or more.
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It’s in times like these I look towards the optimistic posters for answers
"anytime you want to meet for lunch and or drinks..or both..my treat ..we can compare degrees . In addition to getting an MBA/MHA from Xavier I also obtained an Masters in Public Health from the Chan School of Public Health ( Harvard) and I doubt very seriously that your educational background can match that.." - ERIC1
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