Is Shemar holding out?

[*rfaulk34*]

(06-11-2025, 05:13 PM)ERIC1 Wrote: The only thing assinine  is for someone to suggest that the cincinnati bengals are the only team in the nfl trashed by national sportswriters

No one said THEY WERE THE ONLY ONE, brainiac. 

I thought you were going golfing?

[Luvnit2]

(06-11-2025, 04:42 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I think a lot of people are going to be surprised that didn't like the Shemar pick. Sure, he might not get tons of sacks as a rookie but I guarantee
he will be an upgrade over what we saw from Sam the last couple of years. The athleticism and ability should just be night and day.

If he can get up to speed quickly, him missing on field work may hamper his PT.

I am just wondering what this quirk in contract is actually. It appeared based on Shemur interview it is something done, but it may not be a mormal contract request for. rookie.

[*rfaulk34*]

I thought we already had a discussion about this?

The hold up on Shemar Stewart's contract is a dispute over the language of his rookie deal, with the Bengals reportedly trying to change the way they void guarantees in future years. Stewart wants his contract to mirror those of recent Bengals first-round picks, who did not have the same language. 



Details of the Dispute:

• Contract Language:
  The Bengals want to include a clause in Stewart's contract that would void guarantees for future years if he defaults on the deal in the current year. 
  

• Stewart's Position:
  Stewart is refusing to practice during mandatory minicamp until the contract dispute is resolved. He has stated he is not asking for anything new but that the Bengals are prioritizing winning arguments over winning games. 
• Bengals' Perspective:
  The Bengals are reportedly trying to set a new precedent with rookie contracts, allowing them to void future guarantees if a player doesn't fulfill their obligations. 
  

[Luvnit2]

(06-11-2025, 05:49 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I thought we already had a discussion about this?

The hold up on Shemar Stewart's contract is a dispute over the language of his rookie deal, with the Bengals reportedly trying to change the way they void guarantees in future years. Stewart wants his contract to mirror those of recent Bengals first-round picks, who did not have the same language. 



Details of the Dispute:

• Contract Language:
  The Bengals want to include a clause in Stewart's contract that would void guarantees for future years if he defaults on the deal in the current year. 
  

• Stewart's Position:
  Stewart is refusing to practice during mandatory minicamp until the contract dispute is resolved. He has stated he is not asking for anything new but that the Bengals are prioritizing winning arguments over winning games. 
• Bengals' Perspective:
  The Bengals are reportedly trying to set a new precedent with rookie contracts, allowing them to void future guarantees if a player doesn't fulfill their obligations. 
  

TY
I obviously missed it or am old and just forgot. 

[jj22]

(06-11-2025, 02:59 PM)ERIC1 Wrote: Chase averaged approximately 8 receptions and 100 yds a game the first 6 games 2024..higgins was suffering from a hamstring injury all season long...look dude if you want to be negative about everything..,God Speed  time for golf and Pappy

I should have specified. According to Chase and Tee themselves... 

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(06-11-2025, 04:53 PM)ochocincos Wrote: In 2022 and 2023, Hubbard put up 12.5 sacks (6.5, 6.0).
As a rookie, Hubbard put up 6.0 sacks.
He was taken 77th overall that year.
Last year was really the only year he really disappointed.

My point being - I'm not interested in just being better than 2024 Sam Hubbard.
Hell, 2024 Ossai was better than 2024 Sam Hubbard.
If I wanted better than Hubbard, just roll with Ossai.
But the team invested as premium of a pick as they could into a new shiny DE, so I expect close to 2024 Ossai this year for SS, but expecting (dare I say NEEDING) to be a 8+ sack a year guy by his 2nd year, 3rd year max to justify taking him so early.
I might be being overly harsh, but if you're taking an edge rusher in Rd 1, they gotta return some early dividends to be worth such an early selection.
Otherwise, you could have taken a DE on Day 2 and used the 1st round selection on an OL, LB, DB, or DT.

Well I think Stewart could put up 6 sacks as a rookie where Trey is the one being the End teams are trying to take away. Plus, Stewart 
should instantly be a better run stopper than Ossai and Murphy who are not good at sealing the edge so far in their respective careers.

Ossai I think will have a breakout year this season rushing the passer and dropping back into coverage at times. Expecting at least 8 
sacks this year from Ossai thriving in Golden's Defense. Ossai should be out there with Trey on passing downs. 

Stewart on running downs.

[Luvnit2]

(06-11-2025, 05:49 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I thought we already had a discussion about this?

The hold up on Shemar Stewart's contract is a dispute over the language of his rookie deal, with the Bengals reportedly trying to change the way they void guarantees in future years. Stewart wants his contract to mirror those of recent Bengals first-round picks, who did not have the same language. 



Details of the Dispute:

• Contract Language:
  The Bengals want to include a clause in Stewart's contract that would void guarantees for future years if he defaults on the deal in the current year. 
  

• Stewart's Position:
  Stewart is refusing to practice during mandatory minicamp until the contract dispute is resolved. He has stated he is not asking for anything new but that the Bengals are prioritizing winning arguments over winning games. 
• Bengals' Perspective:
  The Bengals are reportedly trying to set a new precedent with rookie contracts, allowing them to void future guarantees if a player doesn't fulfill their obligations. 
  

This may be accurate, but do we know this is the issue? Here is a detailed list of possble issues as not many thing are negotiable in a rookie contract. It lists one of them being voiding guarantees, if so it is not new news as is suggested.

They also list camp bonuses can be an issue as well as other guarantees.
https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/agents-take-2025-nfl-rookie-contract-projections-for-key-round-1-picks-with-wage-scale-explainer/

[SouthernFan]

(06-11-2025, 04:45 PM)Joelist Wrote: Some weird rumors floating around that we are not the only or the first team with this new clause in rookie contracts. Some say Philly doing it also and others (including Florio?) that pretty much everyone else has it? I'm trying to scare up something more substantial but it is interesting.

Thanks for trying to run this down. Perhaps the Bengals bashing is not so justified. In any case, he will either sign or he won’t. If he doesn’t and re-enters the draft next year, he would likely be drafted much lower, possibly even in later rounds. He risks losing out on money he will never make up. Right now he is just hurting himself and the team.

[*ochocincos*]

(06-11-2025, 05:59 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Well I think Stewart could put up 6 sacks as a rookie where Trey is the one being the End teams are trying to take away. Plus, Stewart 
should instantly be a better run stopper than Ossai and Murphy who are not good at sealing the edge so far in their respective careers.

Ossai I think will have a breakout year this season rushing the passer and dropping back into coverage at times. Expecting at least 8 
sacks this year from Ossai thriving in Golden's Defense. Ossai should be out there with Trey on passing downs. 

Stewart on running downs.

I think we may need to pump the breaks on Stewart then.

Ossai didn't choose to re-sign to serve as a backup or play in a limited role only. Not to mention Bengals aren't going to pay someone $8 mill to be a specialized role player either.


I fully expect Hendrickson to continue his 70% or more of defensive snaps like last year.
Ossai played 51% of the defensive snaps last year, and I expect him to be used at least that much this year, if not >60%.
My guess is it's primarily Hendrickson and Ossai getting the bulk of the reps and MM and SS serving in rotational/situational roles on limited snaps (300-400 snaps each).
They'll also find probably ~200-300 snaps ish for guys like Cam Sample and Ced Johnson.

[*ochocincos*]

(06-11-2025, 05:49 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: I thought we already had a discussion about this?

The hold up on Shemar Stewart's contract is a dispute over the language of his rookie deal, with the Bengals reportedly trying to change the way they void guarantees in future years. Stewart wants his contract to mirror those of recent Bengals first-round picks, who did not have the same language. 



Details of the Dispute:

• Contract Language:
  The Bengals want to include a clause in Stewart's contract that would void guarantees for future years if he defaults on the deal in the current year. 
  

• Stewart's Position:
  Stewart is refusing to practice during mandatory minicamp until the contract dispute is resolved. He has stated he is not asking for anything new but that the Bengals are prioritizing winning arguments over winning games. 
• Bengals' Perspective:
  The Bengals are reportedly trying to set a new precedent with rookie contracts, allowing them to void future guarantees if a player doesn't fulfill their obligations. 
  

What does "defaults on the deal in the current year" or "if player doesn't fulfill their obligations" mean in the context of someone in their rookie year?

[Essex Johnson]

(06-11-2025, 06:36 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I think we may need to pump the breaks on Stewart then.

Ossai didn't choose to re-sign to serve as a backup or play in a limited role only. Not to mention Bengals aren't going to pay someone $8 mill to be a specialized role player either.


I fully expect Hendrickson to continue his 70% or more of defensive snaps like last year.
Ossai played 51% of the defensive snaps last year, and I expect him to be used at least that much this year, if not >60%.
My guess is it's primarily Hendrickson and Ossai getting the bulk of the reps and MM and SS serving in rotational/situational roles on limited snaps (300-400 snaps each).
They'll also find probably ~200-300 snaps ish for guys like Cam Sample and Ced Johnson.

there is no pumping the brakes on Stewart, he was drafted to start... and who knows what Trey is going to do, we don;t need to pump the brakes, we need to press the gas..

[*ochocincos*]

(06-11-2025, 06:40 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: there is no pumping the brakes on Stewart, he was drafted to start... and who knows what Trey is going to do, we don;t need to pump the brakes, we need to press the gas..

Was he? Is there a statement from Taylor, Golden, or the FO confirming this?

[Soonerpeace]

(06-11-2025, 04:54 PM)ochocincos Wrote: Either way, it's on Zac now that they've pushed Lou to the side.
If you get more of the same with someone new, it's probably not the person's fault much that you replaced. It's probably more of a problem with the folks who have still stuck around.

Not knowing how much was his influence on the hiring of Al Golden or not I’d like to know. Zac did pull the trigger on Lou. His decision. But the way the franchise is run is different. The defense has not signed a major free agent. If they don’t re-sign Trey can’t expect much on defense. The Brown’s assume some responsibility for wins and losses. But Zac’s got to I’d expect at least make the playoffs.

[sandwedge]

(06-11-2025, 04:53 PM)ochocincos Wrote: In 2022 and 2023, Hubbard put up 12.5 sacks (6.5, 6.0).
As a rookie, Hubbard put up 6.0 sacks.
He was taken 77th overall that year.
Last year was really the only year he really disappointed.

My point being - I'm not interested in just being better than 2024 Sam Hubbard.
Hell, 2024 Ossai was better than 2024 Sam Hubbard.
If I wanted better than Hubbard, just roll with Ossai.
But the team invested as premium of a pick as they could into a new shiny DE, so I expect close to 2024 Ossai this year for SS, but expecting (dare I say NEEDING) to be a 8+ sack a year guy by his 2nd year, 3rd year max to justify taking him so early.
I might be being overly harsh, but if you're taking an edge rusher in Rd 1, they gotta return some early dividends to be worth such an early selection.
Otherwise, you could have taken a DE on Day 2 and used the 1st round selection on an OL, LB, DB, or DT.

I think you are going to be disappointed this season. I didn't like the pick, still don't but was willing to give him a chance, until his latest press. I am more excited about Knight and Fairchild.

[*rfaulk34*]

(06-11-2025, 06:39 PM)ochocincos Wrote: What does "defaults on the deal in the current year" or "if player doesn't fulfill their obligations" mean in the context of someone in their rookie year?

That's the ambiguous language that any sane individual wouldn't like. I don't know if the specific potential infractions are spelled out or if it's general. 

From my understanding, it's not uncommon to lose guarantees in the year of the "infraction", but this language says that you forfeit any and all remaining guarantees, from the time of infraction. 


I'm sure Jermaine Burton had a lot to do with this...

[*ochocincos*]

(06-11-2025, 07:48 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: That's the ambiguous language that any sane individual wouldn't like. I don't know if the specific potential infractions are spelled out or if it's general. 

From my understanding, it's not uncommon to lose guarantees in the year of the "infraction", but this language says that you forfeit any and all remaining guarantees, from the time of infraction. 


I'm sure Jermaine Burton had a lot to do with this...

I mean if that really is the reason, just don't draft guys you may have concerns about their character in any way...
I didn't think Stewart really had any though, just that he was extremely unproductive in college.

[*rfaulk34*]

(06-11-2025, 07:55 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I mean if that really is the reason, just don't draft guys you may have concerns about their character in any way...
I didn't think Stewart really had any though, just that he was extremely unproductive in college.

That's kind of impossible to do. I'm sure they don't expect any issues with Stewart, but this is just another way for this cheap ass org to create a potential new revenue stream by not having to pay someone. 

I'm also pretty sure, even though they knew he had flags, they didn't expect Burton to be such a massive chucklehead last year. They basically paid him an entire years salary for diddly squat. 

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(06-11-2025, 08:00 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: That's kind of impossible to do. I'm sure they don't expect any issues with Stewart, but this is just another way for this cheap ass org to create a potential new revenue stream by not having to pay someone. 

I'm also pretty sure, even though they knew he had flags, they didn't expect Burton to be such a massive chucklehead last year. They basically paid him an entire years salary for diddly squat. 

Burton was a 3rd round pick. He only had ~$1m guaranteed at signing. They could cut him at any time they want to. They'd save ~$530k in cap space by cutting him right now.

[*rfaulk34*]

(06-11-2025, 08:26 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Burton was a 3rd round pick. He only had ~$1m guaranteed at signing. They could cut him at any time they want to. They'd save ~$530k in cap space by cutting him right now.

A penny saved is a penny earned, my good man. 

[Essex Johnson]

(06-11-2025, 06:44 PM)ochocincos Wrote: , 
Was he? Is there a statement from Taylor, Golden, or the FO confirming this?

so we drafted him to sit the bench ?? where is that statement?  i guess Knight and  Fairchild was drafted to sit the bench too. come on man