Michigan Primary

[GMDino]

P01135809 soundly defeated Haley.

Biden won easily also.

Heard a story on the radio this morning about voters very upset with Biden supporting Israel and the genocide (their word) in Gaza.  Many saying they will not vote for Biden in November, even though they did yesterday, if things do not change.

One person interviewed, a Muslim, said he would switch his vote to P01135809 instead.  

So they will not vote for Biden because of what is happening with Israel but will vote for the guy who's plan is to ban Muslim and fly plane loads of immigrants out of the country.

Secondly, I have to question the voting results. If we never got to the bottom of the rigged election in Michigan in 2020 how can we trust that P01135809 really won this time?  We need to have several recounts and perhaps have the machines audited.  

[Belsnickel]

Honestly, the Michigan results should be a concern for Biden. There was the movement for "uncommitted" in Michigan which was an effort to show the displeasure towards the US policy in Israel.

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/27/1234279958/biden-uncommitted-democrats-michigan-primary-election-2024-

They exceeded their goal. Now, Biden still had great support, but in a state where the results have been extremely close in the last two elections Biden can't afford to lose any support from this group. The race was decided by less than 155,000 votes in 2020, so this will be interesting to watch.

[Luvnit2]

I saw percents but not number of votes. It is interesting to see total number of Democrats who voted against number of of Republicans

As for the attempted sarcasm joke, fell flat since Trump did not beat her by 10,000. beat her by well over 100K

[CJD]

(02-28-2024, 10:32 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Honestly, the Michigan results should be a concern for Biden. There was the movement for "uncommitted" in Michigan which was an effort to show the displeasure towards the US policy in Israel.

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/27/1234279958/biden-uncommitted-democrats-michigan-primary-election-2024-

They exceeded their goal. Now, Biden still had great support, but in a state where the results have been extremely close in the last two elections Biden can't afford to lose any support from this group. The race was decided by less than 155,000 votes in 2020, so this will be interesting to watch.

Yep, 13.3% of the vote (a little over 100,000 votes) went to uncommitted.

Hopefully, Biden's answer to a question he was posed while eating ice cream with Seth Meyers comes to pass and a ceasefire is negotiated before the end of the weekend.

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 10:36 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I saw percents but not number of votes. It is interesting to see total number of Democrats who voted against number of of Republicans

As for the attempted sarcasm joke, fell flat since Trump did not beat her by 10,000. beat her by well over 100K

Sure he did.  *wink*

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 10:32 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Honestly, the Michigan results should be a concern for Biden. There was the movement for "uncommitted" in Michigan which was an effort to show the displeasure towards the US policy in Israel.

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/27/1234279958/biden-uncommitted-democrats-michigan-primary-election-2024-

They exceeded their goal. Now, Biden still had great support, but in a state where the results have been extremely close in the last two elections Biden can't afford to lose any support from this group. The race was decided by less than 155,000 votes in 2020, so this will be interesting to watch.

I suppose the question is if they will switch to P01135809 like the one person interviewed or just not vote?  And will Biden's support still be more than the other guy when the chips are down in November.

[Belsnickel]

(02-28-2024, 10:49 AM)GMDino Wrote: I suppose the question is if they will switch to P01135809 like the one person interviewed or just not vote?  And will Biden's support still be more than the other guy when the chips are down in November.

Whether they choose not to turn out or turn out for the other candidate is really going to result in the same thing. To be clear, though, there are a lot of things that can happen to change the math between now and then. The number of self-identifying Republicans who say a felony conviction would disqualify Trump exceeds the number of Democrats bashing the Biden positions on Gaza. There is a lot left to happen.

[GMDino]

(02-28-2024, 11:10 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Whether they choose not to turn out or turn out for the other candidate is really going to result in the same thing. To be clear, though, there are a lot of things that can happen to change the math between now and then. The number of self-identifying Republicans who say a felony conviction would disqualify Trump exceeds the number of Democrats bashing the Biden positions on Gaza. There is a lot left to happen.

That's more what I was getting at.  Yes in both cases the numbers for Biden drop, but do the numbers for P01135809 rise?  

Can his rock solid base be enough to overcome even those who who will hold their nose and vote for Biden.

Heck neither one of these guys might make it to November!

THAT would be an interesting turn of events!

[GMDino]

Haley on got 26% of the vote...but it was 300,000 votes.

If none of those people will vote for P01135809 he has an issue there too.

[CJD]

(02-28-2024, 11:23 AM)GMDino Wrote: Haley on got 26% of the vote...but it was 300,000 votes.

If none of those people will vote for P01135809 he has an issue there too.

That depends on whether those people voted for Haley simply because they prefer her to Trump, or if they are ideologically opposed to voting for Trump.

What percentage of Haley voters would outright reject Trump? If this were a typical primary, the number would be somewhere in the lower percentiles. But with Trump, it could be as high as 75%. It's hard to say.

With the noncommitted, we know the answer to that question. Those people are unequivocally opposed to voting for Biden.

[Arturo Bandini]

(02-28-2024, 10:32 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Honestly, the Michigan results should be a concern for Biden. There was the movement for "uncommitted" in Michigan which was an effort to show the displeasure towards the US policy in Israel.

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/27/1234279958/biden-uncommitted-democrats-michigan-primary-election-2024-

They exceeded their goal. Now, Biden still had great support, but in a state where the results have been extremely close in the last two elections Biden can't afford to lose any support from this group. The race was decided by less than 155,000 votes in 2020, so this will be interesting to watch.

It's more we are voting for you but only because you face Trump. 

There is no Biden cult but a lot of people think that a dying Joe Biden would be a better choice than the republican nominee  with only one program : AVENGE HIMSELF the cruelest way possible ... 

So yes, it is not a surprise to me. 

[*pally*]

(02-28-2024, 10:36 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I saw percents but not number of votes. It is interesting to see total number of Democrats who voted against number of of Republicans

As for the attempted sarcasm joke, fell flat since Trump did not beat her by 10,000. beat her by well over 100K

Republicans had 2 viable candidates running.  The Democrats, while others were on the ballot, are committed to Biden.  Not a real surprise that more people come out for the competitive race

Joe Biden defeated Donald Trump by 150,000 in 2020 in Michigan...but somehow even that election was rigged according to MAGAworld.  Why is the election only rigged when Trump loses?

[*Nately120*]

(02-28-2024, 02:30 PM)pally Wrote: Why is the election only rigged when Trump loses?

I'm pretty sure Trump said the 2016 election was rigged against him even though he won because he won the popular vote, too.  Trump's also at various times made statements that if the votes were actually counted fairly he'd win in CA and NY and so on and so forth...which is funny because Trump losing bigly in those states leads his supporters to declare them shithole hotbeds of filth and commie scum but I guess they're also MAGA strongholds?  It's interesting how mainstream being utterly full of shit and contradicting yourself constantly has become.

Trump contradicting his the cope of his followers is amusing, starting with his inauguration crowd:

PUNDITS - Trump had a smaller crowd for his inauguration than Obama.
CONSERVATIVES - Yeah well that's a good thing because it means his supporters aren't jobless losers like Obama's.
TRUMP - Don't believe your eyes, I had the BIGGEST inauguration crowd EVER, way bigger than Obama's!
CONSERVATIVES - In your face, liberals!!!!!

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-28-2024, 02:30 PM)pally Wrote: Republicans had 2 viable candidates running.  The Democrats, while others were on the ballot, are committed to Biden.  Not a real surprise that more people come out for the competitive race

Joe Biden defeated Donald Trump by 150,000 in 2020 in Michigan...but somehow even that election was rigged according to MAGAworld.  Why is the election only rigged when Trump loses?

Ask Hillary, she thinks it was rigged when he won.  So does Hakeem Jeffries for that matter.  Odd that I've never seen you comment on that.

[Arturo Bandini]

Agreed.

Seeing Hillary everywhere claiming it was rigged, refusing to concede and planning a country wide grift lasting almost 4 years with all those lawsuits rejected was pretty embarrassing.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-28-2024, 04:30 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: Agreed.

Seeing Hillary everywhere claiming it was rigged, refusing to concede and planning a country wide grift lasting almost 4 years with all those lawsuits rejected was pretty embarrassing.

Either you have an issue with claiming our elections aren't valid or you don't.  If you want to argue degree because it helps you avoid your hypocrisy then fine.  Whatever helps you sleep at night.

[XenoMorph]

(02-28-2024, 10:11 AM)GMDino Wrote: P01135809 soundly defeated Haley.

Biden won easily also.

Heard a story on the radio this morning about voters very upset with Biden supporting Israel and the genocide (their word) in Gaza.  Many saying they will not vote for Biden in November, even though they did yesterday, if things do not change.

One person interviewed, a Muslim, said he would switch his vote to P01135809 instead.  

So they will not vote for Biden because of what is happening with Israel but will vote for the guy who's plan is to ban Muslim and fly plane loads of immigrants out of the country.

Secondly, I have to question the voting results. If we never got to the bottom of the rigged election in Michigan in 2020 how can we trust that P01135809 really won this time?  We need to have several recounts and perhaps have the machines audited.  

cause michigan would be on of the last places to cheat in his favor

[*Nately120*]

(02-28-2024, 04:33 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote:
Either you have an issue with claiming our elections aren't valid or you don't.  If you want to argue degree because it helps you avoid your hypocrisy then fine.  Whatever helps you sleep at night.

I think he's saying that actions speak louder than words.  Hillary and Trump both lost an election and cried "rigged" and one side moved on to a different candidate and won back the white house while the other side bought "TRUMP WON" merch and send a buttload of money to the "STOP THE STEAL" fund and decided the double-down on him as a candidate.

It's possible there are people out there who own "HILLARY WON AND YOU KNOW IT" flags and/or send her money to overturn the 2016 election, and if so they will receive a similar amused snort of derision from my deep state-addled brain.

Hillary is a political persona non grata following 2016, Trump is still a godlike figure and might be the next president.  I think it's clear that people aren't as cool with Hillary saying it was rigged.  If Trump is Russell Wilson, as in a damaged former winner who may rise again, Hillary is Paxton Lynch.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(02-28-2024, 06:23 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I think he's saying that actions speak louder than words.  Hillary and Trump both lost an election and cried "rigged" and one side moved on to a different candidate and won back the white house while the other side bought "TRUMP WON" merch and send a buttload of money to the "STOP THE STEAL" fund and decided the double-down on him as a candidate.

So you're agreeing with me, that it's a matter of degree.

Quote:It's possible there are people out there who own "HILLARY WON AND YOU KNOW IT" flags and/or send her money to overturn the 2016 election, and if so they will receive a similar amused snort of derision from my deep state-addled brain.

It has nothing to do with whether you find one person, or action, more contemptable.  It's whether you condemn the core action or you do not.  If labeling our election results as illegitimate hurts our nation then one must naturally condemn Clinton and Jeffries (you know the House minority leader as of right now) or any of the other Dems who made the same claims in 2016.  You can certainly find Trump to be a greater offender, for reasons you already gave, but you cannot also not take issue with Clinton, Jeffries and others simply because they didn't reach the exact same pitch.

Quote:Hillary is a political persona non grata following 2016, Trump is still a godlike figure and might be the next president.  I think it's clear that people aren't as cool with Hillary saying it was rigged.  If Trump is Russell Wilson, as in a damaged former winner who may rise again, Hillary is Paxton Lynch.

Is Hakeem Jeffries persona non grata?  If the Dems are in charge of the House he's the Speaker in a hot minute.

[*Nately120*]

(02-28-2024, 07:06 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: It has nothing to do with whether you find one person, or action, more contemptable.  It's whether you condemn the core action or you do not.  If labeling our election results as illegitimate hurts our nation then one must naturally condemn Clinton and Jeffries (you know the House minority leader as of right now) or any of the other Dems who made the same claims in 2016.  You can certainly find Trump to be a greater offender, for reasons you already gave, but you cannot also not take issue with Clinton, Jeffries and others simply because they didn't reach the exact same pitch.

I'd say voters took issue with Hillary by throwing her aside and digging up Obama's VP.  I'm not sure what else you expect a political party and/or their voters to do other than move on.  Moving on is the most you can do in this case, I'd say.

What is the operational definition of "condemnation" in regards to a political sore loser?  I'm just saying that Hillary and lost and whined and the party moved on from her and Trump lost and whined and the party rallied around him, so in my mind one party condemned their loser candidate and the other didn't.

So tell me what I need to do to condemn Hillary and Hakeem Jefferies and Trump and I'll do it right now.