Foreign Influence on POTUS

[*pally*]

(01-08-2024, 02:56 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Sorry to derail the thread Bels.


I thought foreign payments were a big reason there is an impeachment inquiry on Biden?

well that is the excuse they are using anyway

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-08-2024, 02:49 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: This is the type of weak partisan apologist stuff I was talking about. I know why it is muddied, and it is soft people in his party. It's really easy for me to condemn the man responsible for organizing and fueling the crowd that assaulted our capitol. It's really easy for me to condemn the man who broke his oath and went through thorough efforts to end democracy in the USA.

You on the other hand, take a weak partisan apologist stance and act like this is just politics as usual. And that same attitude is pervasive in the party. Which is why your party leader is still a friend of Epstein oath breaking traitor.

Your perception of this is unfortunately skewed.  if you despise Trump as much as you claim, and I have no reason to doubt you, then understanding the points I am making becomes rather important.  While there are certainly individuals who will stand by him no matter what, there are a sizeable number of people who are swayed by their perception of current events.  These are not inherently bad people, they just see some truth to Trump's BS because there is some truth to them.  He's probably about 90% bullshit, but you guys ignore that he occasionally has a point, as in the media and their coverage of him, or with the Bragg indictment.  By automatically dismissing his claims, even when they have some merit, as baseless drivel you only reinforce the perception of the people I am describing, that Trump is being treated unfairly.  

As I said earlier, I hammer into my officers that the appearance of impropriety is as bad as actual impropriety in most cases.  In that regard your dismissal of any nuanced view of Trump, and his claims, does exactly that.  You're supplying the proof to people that you should desperately want to sway to your view of things.  As Bel said earlier, most people don't do nuanced well, if at all, and this thread is providing a near perfect example of this.

[*pally*]

You want nuanced evaluation of a man who lacks nuances. Even in his occasional right points, with his record, one has to look and see what his motive was. A person who operates in the 90% BS world loses the right to be taken with anything but a jaundiced eye.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-08-2024, 08:10 PM)pally Wrote: You want nuanced evaluation of a man who lacks nuances.  Even in his occasional right points, with his record, one has to look and see what his motive was.  A person who operates in the 90% BS world loses the right to be taken with anything but a jaundiced eye.

I would think we'd want a nuanced evaluation of everyone.  Also, I don't think a person being nuanced is a prerequisite for doing so.  No one is saying you can't view him through whatever lens you want, what is being argued is that not everyone uses the same lens and understanding the different perspectives of others, and how they came to them, is rather important.

Or we could continue to throw tantrums and berate anyone who doesn't believe everything we believe on every subject.

[*pally*]

(01-08-2024, 09:03 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I would think we'd want a nuanced evaluation of everyone.  Also, I don't think a person being nuanced is a prerequisite for doing so.  No one is saying you can't view him through whatever lens you want, what is being argued is that not everyone uses the same lens and understanding the different perspectives of others, and how they came to them, is rather important.

Or we could continue to throw tantrums and berate anyone who doesn't believe everything we believe on every subject.

I do agree understanding different perspectives is important. Maybe with Trump the “nuanced” conversation needs to flip. What you see and hear with Trump is what you get. There are no subtleties in the man. So maybe the nuance has to come from the perception of the man.
I truly would like to understand the utter devotion and deification of the man by his supporters. I’ve been waiting 8 years for a logical explanation n have yet to receive one. And maybe expecting any level of logic from people ho have a cult like devotion to a man is a step too far.

[GMDino]

(01-09-2024, 03:04 AM)pally Wrote: I do agree understanding different perspectives is important. Maybe with Trump the “nuanced” conversation needs to flip. What you see and hear with Trump is what you get.  There are no subtleties in the man. So maybe the nuance has to come from the perception of the man.
I truly would like to understand the utter devotion and deification of the man by his supporters. I’ve been waiting 8 years for a logical explanation n have yet to receive one. And maybe expecting any level of logic from people ho have a cult like devotion to a man is a step too far.

P01135809 was 100% right about one thing for sure:  He could shoot a man and none of his supporters would not bat an eye.

Folks think he deserves every break and consideration because of who he is why completely ignoring who he is.

[CKwi88]

(01-09-2024, 11:07 AM)GMDino Wrote: P01135809 was 100% right about one thing for sure:  He could shoot a man and none of his supporters would not bat an eye.

Folks think he deserves every break and consideration because of who he is why completely ignoring who he is.

Depending on who he shoots you'd probably have people going all "yeah, but there's so much other legitimate criticism of him"  

[Arturo Bandini]

(01-09-2024, 03:04 AM)pally Wrote: I do agree understanding different perspectives is important. Maybe with Trump the “nuanced” conversation needs to flip. What you see and hear with Trump is what you get.  There are no subtleties in the man. So maybe the nuance has to come from the perception of the man.
I truly would like to understand the utter devotion and deification of the man by his supporters. I’ve been waiting 8 years for a logical explanation n have yet to receive one. And maybe expecting any level of logic from people ho have a cult like devotion to a man is a step too far.

He allows people to be their worst selves, to release the inner beast. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(01-09-2024, 01:26 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: He allows people to be their worst selves, to release the inner beast. 

Dude, adults are responsible for their own behavior.  Any adults reaction to Trump, whatever the reaction is, is their responsibility alone.

[*pally*]

(01-09-2024, 02:21 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Dude, adults are responsible for their own behavior.  Any adults reaction to Trump, whatever the reaction is, is their responsibility alone.

Except for Trump of course. He is never is responsible for his own behavior.  

[*Nately120*]

(01-09-2024, 02:21 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Dude, adults are responsible for their own behavior.  Any adults reaction to Trump, whatever the reaction is, is their responsibility alone.

I actually heard American moms everywhere have replaced their old rhetoric with "If the commander in chief commanded you jump off a bridge, would you do it?!"

[Dill]

(01-09-2024, 01:26 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: He allows people to be their worst selves, to release the inner beast. 

I wouldn't say "allows"; I'd say "encourages,"

or in the case of his lawyers and WH staff, "demands." 

If he's back in the WH, he'll be even more rigorous in his selection of those most ready to release their "inner beast." 

It will be the sycophants' responsibility alone though, if we elect Trump and put him position to staff government with worse people this time around.

 

[Dill]

(01-08-2024, 08:10 PM)pally Wrote: You want nuanced evaluation of a man who lacks nuances.  Even in his occasional right points, with his record, one has to look and see what his motive was.  A person who operates in the 90% BS world loses the right to be taken with anything but a jaundiced eye.

Yow Pally! 

Forget that that 90% includes the BS which convinced some 55 million people the election was stolen and continues to foul our politics

with the most dangerous and democracy-threatening conspiracies, and a vengeance-motivated impeachment. 

We need to pluck out some odd examples of Trump being unfairly treated--like that one tv station in Seattle that made him look green--to explain why

people think the liberal press is unfair to Trump. Exposing that unfairness and reminding people that Trump is "right sometimes" will restore people's

faith in our politics and the MSM, undoing the alternative reality he has created for his followers.

[Arturo Bandini]

Well, I do agree he is unfairly treated for once.

If he was like you and me or any average citizen and not a billionnaire's son, he would be in jail since a long time.

[GMDino]

(01-09-2024, 04:07 PM)pally Wrote: Except for Trump of course. He is never is responsible for his own behavior.  

Indeed!

https://www.semafor.com/article/01/09/2024/trump-immunity-hearing-president-assassinate-rival-not-prosecuted

Quote:Former president Donald Trump’s lawyer argued that presidential immunity would cover the U.S. president ordering political rivals to be assassinated by SEAL Team Six.


During a hearing at a federal appeals court on Tuesday, Trump’s lead lawyer John Sauer made a sweeping argument for executive immunity, essentially saying that only a president who has been impeached and removed from office by Congress could be criminally prosecuted. Therefore, Sauer argued, the former president should be shielded from criminal prosecution.


One of the judges asked Sauer: “Could a president who ordered SEAL Team 6 to assassinate a political rival, and is not impeached, would he be subject to criminal prosecution?”


Sauer responded: “If he were impeached and convicted first... there is a political process that would have to occur.”


The court is considering an appeal in Trump’s election obstruction case after the trial judge already rejected these same arguments about the scope of presidential immunity.


Assistant special counsel James Pearce urged the panels of judges to reject Trump’s argument. “Never in our nation’s history until this case has a president claimed that immunity from criminal prosecution extends beyond his time in office,” he told the court. All three of the judges expressed skepticism about Trump’s legal argument, repeatedly grilling his lawyer on the immunity claims.



The outcome of the arguments is expected to have major implications for Trump’s 2024 bid.

[NATI BENGALS]

(01-09-2024, 10:35 PM)GMDino Wrote: Indeed!

https://www.semafor.com/article/01/09/2024/trump-immunity-hearing-president-assassinate-rival-not-prosecuted

So they are saying if you get enough Gaetz and Boeberts and Marjories elected in our gerrymandered districts, a slim majority of yes men (loyal) to their ruler he can kill off everyone on the supreme court as long as he isn't impeached. Seems legit.

[*pally*]

You have to wonder how anyone can trust a man who claims he is above the law and the constitution.

[*Nately120*]

(01-10-2024, 09:13 AM)pally Wrote: You have to wonder how anyone can trust a man who claims he is above the law and the constitution.

It's extra wacky because Trump clearly trusts Biden seeing as Trump is trying to make it known and/or make it so that a president has legal immunity to have political rivals assassinated. Clearly the idea is that the president having the ability to assassinate political rivals would only apply to him as the president, not the rival. He knows Biden isn't going to make use of this, and it's worth the risk to let Biden have that ability for a year so Trump can have it from 2024 to whenever. Seal Team 6 dropping Liz Cheney on day 1 of Trump's second term would be newsworthy, I'll admit.

This is the funniest thing about the Trump era.

2016 - Ehh, let's see what happens, how crazy could it get?
2024 - The president has full immunity and can have political rivals assassinated!

After all this you really have to wonder what we're going to get after signing up for another 4+ years of this guy in power.  Wee!

[*pally*]

(01-10-2024, 03:24 PM)Nately120 Wrote: It's extra wacky because Trump clearly trusts Biden seeing as Trump is trying to make it known and/or make it so that a president has legal immunity to have political rivals assassinated.  Clearly the idea is that the president having the ability to assassinate political rivals would only apply to him as the president, not the rival.  He knows Biden isn't going to make use of this, and it's worth the risk to let Biden have that ability for a year so Trump can have it from 2024 to whenever.  Seal Team 6 dropping Liz Cheney on day 1 of Trump's second term would be newsworthy, I'll admit.

This is the funniest thing about the Trump era.

2016 - Ehh, let's see what happens, how crazy could it get?
2024 - The president has full immunity and can have political rivals assassinated!

After all this you really have to wonder what we're going to get after signing up for another 4+ years of this guy in power.  Wee!

same type of logic:

Republicans: Jan 6 was caused by ANTIFA, BLM, and FBI plants

Republican candidates: we are going to pardon all of the Jan 6 prisoners

[Arturo Bandini]

Looks like being tough on China is just overpricing rooms at a Trump Hotel.

How smart is that guys ?

Well, back to Hunter, folks.