Biden pandering to middle class and illegal immigrants

[Luvnit2]

Joe Biden panders on "who built this country" in speeches.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-torched-claiming-undocumented-immigrants-built-this-country-saying-same-middle-class

Any guess who will be next after he said the middle class built this country and then strangely said illegal immigrants built this country. He regrets using the term illegal, yet has no regrets calling Laken Riley, Lincoln Riley. Biden more concerned will how illegal immigrants feel than the people killed by them.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-torched-claiming-undocumented-immigrants-built-this-country-saying-same-middle-class

Biden torched for claiming 'undocumented' immigrants 'built this country' after saying same of middle class
Biden says he regrets describing Laken Riley's accused murderer as an 'illegal,' opts for term 'undocumented.'


President Biden received criticism online for claiming in a recent interview that "undocumented" immigrants built this country.

The statement came as he apologized for using the term "illegal" to describe Jose Ibarra, the Venezuelan national accused of killing Augusta University nursing student Laken Riley. The president drew backlash on social media for crediting illegal immigrants for having "built" the U.S. – something he had previously credited to the American middle class.

"In his SOTU speech he said unions and the middle class built this country, now he says ‘undocumented’ immigrants built the country. Any guess as to who he will say built the country the next time he’s speaking to an African-American audience?" journalist Jeff Gremillion wrote on X.

[BigPapaKain]

He ain't exactly wrong. I doubt the slaves who actually built the country were documented.

[SunsetBengal]

(03-10-2024, 06:51 PM)BigPapaKain Wrote: He ain't exactly wrong. I doubt the slaves who actually built the country were documented.

By 'slaves', I'm assuming that you are including the Irish ones along with the African ones, right?

[*Nately120*]

(03-10-2024, 06:55 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: By 'slaves', I'm assuming that you are including the Irish ones along with the African ones, right?

As someone who is both Irish and Italian, I can assure you I'm only in this country because the government decided to let my "probably rapists" ancestors in.  Tale as old as time, really.

[GMDino]

(03-10-2024, 06:55 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: By 'slaves', I'm assuming that you are including the Irish ones along with the African ones, right?

https://history.ucsd.edu/_files/undergraduate/honors-theses/Slaves-To-A-Myth.pdf

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN23Q1KO/

Quote:A lengthy post relating to Irish people and slavery has been widely reposted and shared on Facebook. The text is from a widely discredited 2008 article.


The text has been posted by multiple Facebook accounts ( here , here , here and here ) and generated thousands of shares. It is extracted from the 2008 article which can be found here .


The piece is credited to a John Martin whose identity cannot be verified.

Irish historian Liam Hogan has rewritten extensively about myths surrounding Irish people and slavery (bit.ly/3hHhDSn) and traces many recent examples of misinformation on the subject back to the 2008 text featured in the posts. In an email to Reuters, he described the piece as “racist ahistorical propaganda”.


Dozens of academics signed a 2016 open letter attacking “’Irish slaves’ disinformation” which singled out the 2008 article as one of the sources of the false narrative (bit.ly/3hD6EJH).

The posts begin by stating: “The Irish slave trade began when 30,000 Irish prisoners were sold as slaves to the New World. The King James I Proclamation of 1625 required Irish political prisoners be sent overseas and sold to English settlers in the West Indies.”


This is an edited version of the original article which named the monarch in question as James II. The claim has been debunked by Hogan, who said there was no evidence for the existence of such a proclamation and pointed out that James II was not born until 1633 (bit.ly/2YU4ixz).

The post also states: “From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English and another 300,000 were sold as slaves.” Hogan, referring to “The Irish Diaspora” by Andrew Bielenberg (here), told Reuters: “The total migration from Ireland to the West Indies for the entire 17th century is estimated to have been around 50,000 people and the total migration from Ireland to British North America and the West Indies is estimated to have been circa 165,000 between 1630 and 1775. If this is the case, where on earth is the meme getting the unequivocal and impossible 300,000 forced deportations from Ireland over a ten year period?”

The post also claims that Irish woman and girls were forced to procreate with African slaves. Hogan writes that there is no evidence to support this claim (bit.ly/2AUaZHE) and states: “These ahistorical claims are part racialised sadomasochistic fantasy and part old white supremacist myth”.


The post also states: “During the 1650s, over 100,000 Irish children between the ages of 10 and 14 were taken from their parents and sold as slaves in the West Indies, Virginia and New England”. There is no evidence to support this figure. In Barbados, where the majority of Irish indentured servants were sent, the total number of white immigrants, indentured or free, by the early 1870s was estimated at 21,500 ( here ).

A recent Reuters fact-checking article on another widely shared meme related to Ireland and slavery can be seen here . It details the differences between temporary indentured servitude and racialized chattel slavery and the appeal of ‘Irish slaves’ myths to racist groups.


VERDICT
False. Facebook posts purporting to describe the origins of “Irish slavery” are a rehash of a 2008 article consisting of numerous false claims.
This article was produced by the Reuters Fact Check team. Read more about our work to fact-check social media posts   here .

[SunsetBengal]

(03-10-2024, 07:51 PM)GMDino Wrote:


https://history.ucsd.edu/_files/undergraduate/honors-theses/Slaves-To-A-Myth.pdf

https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN23Q1KO/

Ok smart guy, then why did so many of them choose flee to the hard to tame Appalachian region for the "freedom" they were told this country represents?  I mean, the boats didn't deliver them there...

[GMDino]

(03-10-2024, 07:57 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Ok smart guy, then why did so many of them choose flee to the hard to tame Appalachian region for the "freedom" they were told this country represents?  I mean, the boats didn't deliver them there...

I was smart enough to know that Irish Slavery was a myth that had been disproven by many people and academics.

You can find a history of the Irish people and their migration on your own, I'm sure.  

[SunsetBengal]

(03-10-2024, 08:01 PM)GMDino Wrote: I was smart enough to know that Irish Slavery was a myth that had been disproven by many people and academics.

You can find a history of the Irish people and their migration on your own, I'm sure.  

Yeah, that "fact check" was from what, 2008?  Isn't that a time period where many 'fact checkers' were found to be quite biased?

Edit: The 'fact checkers' seem to want to draw a line between "indentured servitude" from "slaves brought from Africa". Either way, they follow parallel paths, the Irish fled to Appalachia, the Africans fled to the Northern part of the US.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-10-2024, 07:45 PM)Nately120 Wrote: As someone who is both Irish and Italian, I can assure you I'm only in this country because the government decided to let my "probably rapists" ancestors in.  Tale as old as time, really.

Bet they weren't Illegals. 

[GMDino]

(03-10-2024, 08:04 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yeah, that "fact check" was from what, 2008?  Isn't that a time period where many 'fact checkers' were found to be quite biased?

Edit:  The 'fact checkers' seem to want to draw a line between "indentured servitude" from "slaves brought from Africa".  Either way, they follow parallel paths, the Irish fled to Appalachia, the Africans fled to the Northern part of the US.

Seems like you have more research to do.  I'm done for the weekend.  Good luck.

[Belsnickel]

(03-10-2024, 07:57 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Ok smart guy, then why did so many of them choose flee to the hard to tame Appalachian region for the "freedom" they were told this country represents?  I mean, the boats didn't deliver them there...

Because it was familiar to them. The Scottish highlands that the Scots-Irish that inhabited this region hailed from are actually the same mountain range that makes up the Appalachians. Since our mountains are older than life itself, they come from one of the super-continents (prior to Pangea) and the mountains of the British Isles are the same as those of the Appalachian range. As a result, there are many similarities between our regions. Plus, they enjoyed the freedom from the English influence, much as the Germans did in this region. While the English were technically in charge over here, their major influence really stopped at the Blue Ridge until shortly before the Revolution.

[Belsnickel]

(03-10-2024, 08:04 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Yeah, that "fact check" was from what, 2008?  Isn't that a time period where many 'fact checkers' were found to be quite biased?

Edit: The 'fact checkers' seem to want to draw a line between "indentured servitude" from "slaves brought from Africa". Either way, they follow parallel paths, the Irish fled to Appalachia, the Africans fled to the Northern part of the US.

That's because there is a big line between those things. Indentured servitude was paying off a debt while the slaves brought from Africa were seen as chattel. They were treated differently both by those that utilized their labor and the law. Indentured servants were still considered people, slaves were not, they were property.

[GMDino]

(03-10-2024, 08:24 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Because it was familiar to them. The Scottish highlands that the Scots-Irish that inhabited this region hailed from are actually the same mountain range that makes up the Appalachians. Since our mountains are older than life itself, they come from one of the super-continents (prior to Pangea) and the mountains of the British Isles are the same as those of the Appalachian range. As a result, there are many similarities between our regions. Plus, they enjoyed the freedom from the English influence, much as the Germans did in this region. While the English were technically in charge over here, their major influence really stopped at the Blue Ridge until shortly before the Revolution.

(03-10-2024, 08:26 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: That's because there is a big line between those things. Indentured servitude was paying off a debt while the slaves brought from Africa were seen as chattel. They were treated differently both by those that utilized their labor and the law. Indentured servants were still considered people, slaves were not, they were property.

The whole Appalachian mountain thing always blows my mind.

[*Nately120*]

(03-10-2024, 08:07 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Bet they weren't Illegals. 

No this country was letting "probably rapists" in legally, which is almost as unpopular as them coming here illegally.  

[Belsnickel]

(03-10-2024, 08:41 PM)GMDino Wrote: The whole Appalachian mountain thing always blows my mind.

I am probably one of the most proud Appalachians most people will run into. My ancestors have been in the region since my 6th great-grandfather was a teamster serving under Washington during both Washington's surrender at Ft. Necessity and at Braddock's Expedition to Ft. Duquesne, otherwise known as Braddock's Folly, and escaped with his life to end up becoming (allegedly) the first white person to set foot in Somerset County, PA. It is interesting that he fought under Washington, considering he had just emigrated from Volksberg, but that's just one of those fun little quirks. He was likely a fur trader at the start given that he set up in Bedford pretty much as soon as he arrived in the 1740's until his recruitment into the Virginia militia (for those that may not know, SW PA was a part of Augusta County, VA, until about the time of the American Revolution).

So anyway, my history in the region runs deep and being that I am a huge nerd about these sorts of things, I love looking into it. Even the geology of it. I have an extinct volcano not far from my house here in the Shenandoah Valley, which while extinct it is still one of the youngest volcanos east of the Mississippi. When you hike a mountain on Skyline Drive there is a line where the rock changes between sedimentary and igneous, and it is interesting to think that these mountains would have once overshadowed the Alps and Rockies, yet because of their age they are but remnants of their former selves.

I said that the mountains were older than life, which really is inaccurate. Life on land is more accurate. There are no terrestrial fossils in Appalachia because when these mountains formed there was only marine life on this planet. John Denver sings "life is old there, older than the trees" and he is right, because trees didn't exist for another 150 million years after these mountains formed (though much like fish, trees also don't really exist, but those are completely different biological tangents of mine).

So yeah, I love this region and its history. I will claim to being Appalachian over just about any other identity I have.

[BigPapaKain]

(03-10-2024, 06:55 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: By 'slaves', I'm assuming that you are including the Irish ones along with the African ones, right?

Native and Asian, too.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-10-2024, 09:36 PM)Nately120 Wrote: No this country was letting "probably rapists" in legally, which is almost as unpopular as them coming here illegally.  

There was no such thing as Illegal's til the Immigration Act of 1924, which established quota's by country.

Until that, people could come here legally, and all but Asians (Chinese specifically) pretty much would become identified as American's.

The biggest differences between then and now, is that back then, you didn't get Government help, you either made it or you didn't.